I'm in earnest! I really DO like Ryoko-san, and I'm currently in the process of getting more exposure where she's concerned. O'course, Satomi-chan is still my number 1 girl, but that's a given.
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I am so glad when a new person watches and loves Seikei Bijin, because I am completely and utterly captivated by it. I watch parts of it every night, and it seems as fresh the millionth time around as it was the first time. She is just to die for in every way...a powerhouse of talent and beauty that is rarely to be seen anywhere. But I am puzzled as to why some people find the leading man dull. I feel that he is the absolutely perfect foil for her. Sure, he's quiet, but underneath that seemingly impassive exterior, he smolders. Very sexy. I agree that the emphasis on external beauty might seem like it's sending the wrong message, but it didn't offend me in this case, because Honami does realize that it's really her lack of self-confidence that plagued her more than her "ugly" self. I think the actress who plays her twin sister is really quite attractive...they really pull out all the stops to get her to look otherwise.

harriet wrote:

I am so glad when a new person watches and loves Seikei Bijin, because I am completely and utterly captivated by it. I watch parts of it every night, and it seems as fresh the millionth time around as it was the first time. She is just to die for in every way...a powerhouse of talent and beauty that is rarely to be seen anywhere.

After my first viewing, I found myself doing the same thing: jumping around to various scenes and picking up little subtle nuances that really make the character and performance so special...

Interestingly, I sent this drama to a friend in Atlanta and he was entranced as well... He likened Ryoko-chan to Audrey Hepburn...High praise indeed.

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But I am puzzled as to why some people find the leading man dull. I feel that he is the absolutely perfect foil for her. Sure, he's quiet, but underneath that seemingly impassive exterior, he smolders. Very sexy.

Not sure about the sexy part, but I agree that Shiina Kippei's character was the perfect complement to Ryoko's wild, wacky character. Everyone seem to be brainwashed that a uber-handsome guy has to play the lead opposite a beautiful female lead for reason and anything contrary to that is unbeleievable or poor casting... Grrr.

Quote:

I agree that the emphasis on external beauty might seem like it's sending the wrong message, but it didn't offend me in this case, because Honami does realize that it's really her lack of self-confidence that plagued her more than her "ugly" self. I think the actress who plays her twin sister is really quite attractive...they really pull out all the stops to get her to look otherwise.

Yeah, they really pulled the stops to make her exceedlingly dumpy, even in some of the print ads and materials... That took a lot of guts.

bmwracer wrote:

Not sure about the sexy part, but I agree that Shiina Kippei's character was the perfect complement to Ryoko's wild, wacky character. Everyone seem to be brainwashed that a uber-handsome guy has to play the lead opposite a beautiful female lead for reason and anything contrary to that is unbeleievable or poor casting... Grrr.

Hmmm... I know I kid about eye-candy lacking for women, but really it's not about that. There was just something about him that I didn't find convincing. I mean, yes, a character that was opposite Ryoko's character was needed to balance everything out... AND make things more interesting. And I liked the fact that he wasn't incredibly gorgeous... that he was just plain and "normal".

I just found the acting poor. I mean, I only have this one role to back me up, but there was something lacking in the eyes. And his smile was never genuine, considering that was a main thing (Honami making him smile when he was incapable of otherwise). Honami influenced him to change, but this change is really hard to make out, because there is nothing in his acting to suggest that he has suddenly been enlightened. He never convincingly looked at her like he loved her.

Of course, this is a personal opinion and I understand that people won't see it the way I do. That's fine. I just found that in Ryoko's presence, he did a very poor job meeting the expectations she exceeded. Perhaps that was the problem.

In the end, it didn't matter what he was like. The drama was still successful and strong.
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Wynter wrote:

I just found the acting poor. I mean, I only have this one role to back me up, but there was something lacking in the eyes. And his smile was never genuine, considering that was a main thing (Honami making him smile when he was incapable of otherwise). Honami influenced him to change, but this change is really hard to make out, because there is nothing in his acting to suggest that he has suddenly been enlightened. He never convincingly looked at her like he loved her.

I sorta felt that way too: I thought he was a stiff. But the more I thought about it and the character, that's just the way he is: reserved and emotionless.

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Of course, this is a personal opinion and I understand that people won't see it the way I do. That's fine. I just found that in Ryoko's presence, he did a very poor job meeting the expectations she exceeded. Perhaps that was the problem.

Heh, maybe. Her character is so dynamic and charismatic... And he's a... Stiff.

Well, I can see everyone's point about "Mr. Florist" not having the dynamism to stand up to the incomparable Ryoko and not looking as if he loved her, but I look at the character a bit differently. He is very emotionally damaged. His father abandoned him, and his mother is cold and bitter and focuses only on the business. He was a lonely kid until his sister arrived, but by then the damage was done. He has learned to keep his emotions in check. Duty over emotion in that family.

WARNING: PLOT REVELATIONS BELOW!!!!

Click on button to reveal/hide spoiler:

That is why he speaks so angrily to her at the abandoned factory after he finds the forget-me-not. He's furious because she has awakened all these emotions. He's always thinking of her. It might not seem a big deal to us, but when he walks through that puddle of water to get to her (even she is startled by it, because it is so uncharacteristic of him), he is making a statement of love. I found him totally convincing when he told her he loved her. He's a serious guy, but I thought the feelings came through. Why would he not be sexy? He kisses her, he touches her, he makes love to her. Maybe you do have to be a woman to appreciate how well he does it.

Harriet: I added the Spoiler Tags to your post.

Thank you! I didn't know how to put the parts I wanted to hide into the blank box. I never liked the word "spoiler" and thought I could get away without using it if I made an appropriate warning message, since they ask for a PROMINENT warning, but if that's not proper forum etiquette, I suppose I can rearrange my thinking.

harriet wrote:

Thank you! I didn't know how to put the parts I wanted to hide into the blank box. I never liked the word "spoiler" and thought I could get away without using it if I made an appropriate warning message, since they ask for a PROMINENT warning, but if that's not proper forum etiquette, I suppose I can rearrange my thinking.

Not sure what the proper etiquette is, since most people are unaware of the spoiler tags to begin with... The fact that you made the effort to warn people is greatly appreciated.

harriet wrote:

Well, I can see everyone's point about "Mr. Florist" not having the dynamism to stand up to the incomparable Ryoko and not looking as if he loved her, but I look at the character a bit differently. He is very emotionally damaged. His father abandoned him, and his mother is cold and bitter and focuses only on the business. He was a lonely kid until his sister arrived, but by then the damage was done. He has learned to keep his emotions in check. Duty over emotion in that family. WARNING: PLOT REVELATIONS BELOW!!!! Click on button to reveal/hide spoiler: That is why he speaks so angrily to her at the abandoned factory after he finds the forget-me-not. He's furious because she has awakened all these emotions. He's always thinking of her. It might not seem a big deal to us, but when he walks through that puddle of water to get to her (even she is startled by it, because it is so uncharacteristic of him), he is making a statement of love. I found him totally convincing when he told her he loved her. He's a serious guy, but I thought the feelings came through. Why would he not be sexy? He kisses her, he touches her, he makes love to her. Maybe you do have to be a woman to appreciate how well he does it.

It's not at all about the character. I think the character was really sexy, and that what the character did and said was really effective in terms of his history and experiences. My qualms are with the actor, and I'm sure my impression will change if I see him in other roles.

And yesh, as a woman, I do see what you mean. But I mean, as a viewer, we see more than what the other characters see, and we learn of his past. But if he was some dude on the street, and came to me with those unfeeling eyes, I wouldn't be convinced.

But regardless, he didn't hinder the drama for me at all, so I suppose he was successful to an extent.
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Big surprise.

Wynter...I'm so glad you are on the forum. You have such interesting things to say. I had looked up the actor playing Mr. Florist on one of the regular websites, because I'd never heard of him, but I thought he was an appealing actor, and this is what they said about him,

"An actor's actor whose versatility allows him to deftly assume a wide range of characters..."

I see what you mean about him...his eyes do not show feeling, but his mouth is more expressive. I think as an actor he tries not to smile at all unless it's scripted. It's like playing Mr. Darcy in Pride and Prejudice...you just can't show emotion but have to somehow suggest that it's there under the surface.

I just watched the beginning trying to figure the actor out...I do like the way he played the scene when he snips the little flower growing in concrete. Something in his voice, the unusual things he says to her, awaken in Honami that once-in-a-lifetime feeling. It works for me, and I'm glad you didn't let your reservations about the leading man mar your enjoyment of all the rest.

harriet wrote:

Wynter...I'm so glad you are on the forum. You have such interesting things to say.

Quote:

I had looked up the actor playing Mr. Florist on one of the regular websites, because I'd never heard of him, but I thought he was an appealing actor, and this is what they said about him, "An actor's actor whose versatility allows him to deftly assume a wide range of characters..." I see what you mean about him...his eyes do not show feeling, but his mouth is more expressive. I think as an actor he tries not to smile at all unless it's scripted. It's like playing Mr. Darcy in Pride and Prejudice...you just can't show emotion but have to somehow suggest that it's there under the surface.

OMG! I LUFF Mr. Darcy!!! He's one of the sexiest characters ever created, especially when played by Colin Firth.

And you're right, Mr. Florist is more expressive with his mouth, and I was impressed with his scenes with the flowers. Like there was confidence, and a sense of earnest passion.

I think it was unfortunate, or fortunate, that I didn't read or hear reviews about his acting before I saw the drama. To be honest, sometimes I DO get influenced by the opinions of others and although they may not affect my own opinion, I do have them in the back of my mind, and pick out just what would have caused those opinions. With him, I wasn't under any influence, and the above posts I made reflect my initial response. I wonder if it will change if I get more exposed to him. I am a bit stubborn, after all.

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It works for me, and I'm glad you didn't let your reservations about the leading man mar your enjoyment of all the rest.

I think actors and plots go hand-in-hand for creating a successful drama for me. He was one in many, and although I wouldn't have prefered him, he managed to get the job done. So it's all good.

O, and happy posting on the forum, Harriet-chan! Tis a really fun place.
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bmwracer wrote:

Big surprise.

LOL! This scene was so grand.
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Wynter wrote:

LOL! This scene was so grand.

Even better when she smacked him silly with her purse.

I recently had a Mr. Darcy fest. You know, for me, before there was the incredibly sexy Colin Firth, there was the incredibly sexy Laurence Olivier.

I went to see the new Pride and Prejudice movie with Keira Knightley, then watched the entire Colin Firth series, then ended with dessert, Olivier and Greer Garson.

Seikei Bijin is kind of a Pride and Prejudice turned on its head. Here the hero is equally impassive and unemotional, drawn to someone of a different social class upon whom his family looks down. But unlike Mr. Darcy, Mr. Florist is very comfortable with the people he meets in Honami's social stratum. He's not a snob. He really yearns for the warmth and comfort and informality of a happy and loving middle class family.

One of the things I love about their relationship at the start is how different from one another they are and therefore how much potential there is for them to grow together and change. That kind of dyanamic quality is always good for a story, whatever the eventual outcome might be.

QUESTION ABOUT SPOILERS

I have only contributed to forums before where everyone is watching a series at the same time, so spoilers don't really come into it, and we're free to discuss every ramification of every plot twist and turn, every little character development, how we are affected by different scenes, etc.

Since Seikei Bijin is not running anywhere at the moment, as far as I know, why can't we just discuss it all and assume that anyone who does not want to know the outcome will wait the few days it takes to watch it before reading and/or joining in the discussion of this forum?

There are other sites where you can get a general plot overview.

I just think it would be so rich and so satisfying an experience to just all plunge in and discuss this series from every point of view that I thought it was worth asking about.

When I write, I have to hold back almost everything I want to say for fear of spoiling it for those who might be on episodes 1, 2, 3 or beyond. There are only so many generalizations you can make about something like this, with so much emotional and psychological truth lurking in almost every other line.

Anyway, I was just wondering.

To be honest, I think it's okay.

Seikei Bijin isn't one of the more popular dramas here at this forum for whatever reason (poor taste, I think) and it's been out for over four years now, so I don't have any issues discussing the drama less the cumbersome spoiler tags.

harriet wrote:

I went to see the new Pride and Prejudice movie with Keira Knightley, then watched the entire Colin Firth series, then ended with dessert, Olivier and Greer Garson.

LOL! You sound like me

B-san wrote:

To be honest, I think it's okay. Seikei Bijin isn't one of the more popular dramas here at this forum for whatever reason (poor taste, I think) and it's been out for over four years now, so I don't have any issues discussing the drama less the cumbersome spoiler tags.

Exactly what senpai said. I don't think there is anyone posting in this thread who HASN'T seen the drama, so express your heart out!

The only place I would be careful about spoilers is the thread discussing what people are currently watching. But in threads like this, I don't see much of a prob.
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Well then, I wanted to address the issue that was brought up of what the series is really saying about what is beautiful and what is ugly and how much of a role one's inner feelings play in determining how people react to us.

I too was a little taken aback when Honami's sister Naomi (I don't know why the subtitles don't get her name right...everyone calls her Naomi, and it makes sense, since the combination Honami/Naomi is so euphonious) at the very end reveals that she too has had plastic surgery and married some handsome blond foreigner.

But then I thought that if you look at the whole thing, what everybody says and does, there is a good message embedded throughout, namely that if you feel like you look good and feel happy with yourself and know that you are worthy of positive attention, you will appear attractive to everyone else.

I think Honami's parents are a good illustration of this, especially her mother. She doesn't feel ugly at all. (I'm not saying she is...just that Honami thinks of her parents and sister that way.) She's serious when she looks at the photo of the newly minted Honami and says she looks just the way she did when she was young. She has a great marriage, a very romantic attachment to her husband, and she never feels she's not good enough. In short, she has the self-confidence both her daughters lack.

The real reason Honami has to have plastic surgery is her low self-esteem, not her lack of beauty. When she realizes she doesn't feel ugly anymore, she is willing to go back to the face she was born with and keep the self-confidence.

You know I thought she would really do it, and I am so much enamored of the magnificent Ryoko, I was terrified her face would be taken away from me and that someone else would play out the wonderfully romantic ending I felt sure would follow.

I didn't feel there was anything wrong with her deciding at the last minute to keep the face she had when she was living out her dream relationship. It was like a momento, a keepsake of that peak experience.

I think they needed to give Naomi a happy ending too. They could have made the actress herself look quite attractive, which I think she is. Look how pretty she looked dressed as a bride. But if they had just given her a new hairdo, great make-up, and some stunning clothes and voila, then it would have negated Honami's story. We have to believe in her ugliness to justify her extreme makeover.

So that makes plastic surgery the only way for Naomi to achieve beauty, and thus gain the same confidence as Honami. She didn't appear to be the philosophical type who could think herself into self-confidence. She lost Ryohei to someone prettier, so why wait around for more self-confidence? Just become traditionally beautiful and go out and get a handsome husband. Is it really such a bad message within the context of the whole drama?