Joined: 04 Jun 2004 Posts: 506 Location: Canada Country:
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:29 am Post subject:
supermidget wrote:
Thank you for your insights Actually I concider myself still a beginner, since I'm only a second year student. I don't have so much experience in using Japanese in daily life so what I know is mainy "book-stuff". And never forget... since anyone can have questions, anyone can have answers right?
Anyhow, there's a bunch of verbs pronounced tomaru... I only know how to use �~�܂� (to come to a halt; to stop) and ���܂� (to stay at; like residing, sleeping over). Besides them two, I found ���܂� in the dictionary before, translated as "to be fixed; to stay". But I've never come across it, so I'm afraid to use it.
I think your suggestion of �Ƃ܂� (but maybe with different kanji) is a good one, though you said you heared it in the sense of "staying at a place (for hotel etc)", which it's a bit different from "staying" like *not leaving*. Did you ever hear it in that way?
�������܂� I'm shaking in fear (of your greatness)
Thank you
Although the kanji ���܂� can be pronounced as �Ƃ܂�, it simply means "to stop" when it is.
If you want to use it as "to stay," it is then pronounced �Ƃǂ܂� [todomaru], but it still doesn't meant "stay" in the sense that you are trying to convey. It means "stay" more in a sense of to remain in the same position (for work, etc.).
Actually, ribi's example does mean "are you staying?" if used in the right context. It does sound like it means "are you here?" but if you are asking the person and you can see or hear them, obviously you know the answer to that question.
Personally, I would add �܂� [mada] into the sentence so that it reads:
and, although literally meaning "are you still here?", if you are asking it to someone that is standing or sitting in front of you, it will always be taken as "are you still going to be here?" or "are you staying?"
On MSN Messenger, for instance, if I'm working on translation work and my friend starts talking to me but I don't have time to chat at that particular moment, I will ask my friend, �u�˂ˁA�܂�����H�v [ne ne, mada iru?], and they will reply with either a yes or no.
HTH,
������ _________________
"I like the word 'indolence'. It makes my laziness seem classy."
-Bern Williams
I'm back... after a few weeks of reading and learning from a tutor, I'm getting better... but still have tons of questions..
Here's one from Nana:
Aite ga toshiue dakara umaku ikanakatta no ka mo
Confused as heck=i read two different version of scanlations, and they were intepreted differently... one says although it might be nice to go out wtih older guys. another ones says always fails because I always go out with older guys.
Joined: 11 Dec 2003 Posts: 406 Location: ������ Country:
Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:27 am Post subject:
fayewolf wrote:
I'm back... after a few weeks of reading and learning from a tutor, I'm getting better... but still have tons of questions..
Here's one from Nana:
Aite ga toshiue dakara umaku ikanakatta no ka mo
Confused as heck=i read two different version of scanlations, and they were intepreted differently... one says although it might be nice to go out wtih older guys. another ones says always fails because I always go out with older guys.
Aite ga toshiue dakara
���肪�N�ゾ����
"Because the partner is older"
umaku ikanakatta no
���܂������Ȃ�������
"the fact that it didn't go well"
ka mo (shirenai)
�����i�m��Ȃ��j
"one can not know" -> should be translated by "maybe"
Maybe it didn't work out because my/his/her partner was older
"ka mo shirenai" is an expression translated by "maybe" or "possibly". "ka mo" is just a short version of it. "umaku" comes from "umai" (tasty) but it's often used to say someone does something well, or when things go 'smooth'. Compare to ii / yoku
umaku shaberu = speak well, smoothly
umaku iku =~ going will
I think the first scanlation you mentioned is just wrong, the second one conveys the message. _________________
Joined: 04 Jun 2004 Posts: 506 Location: Canada Country:
Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:35 am Post subject:
fayewolf wrote:
I'm back... after a few weeks of reading and learning from a tutor, I'm getting better... but still have tons of questions..
Here's one from Nana:
Aite ga toshiue dakara umaku ikanakatta no ka mo
Confused as heck=i read two different version of scanlations, and they were intepreted differently... one says although it might be nice to go out wtih older guys. another ones says always fails because I always go out with older guys.
Although I have no idea what you are trying to say by 'scanlations' and them being interpreted differently, I can guarantee you that there is only one way of interpreting the actual sentence.
Aite ga = "The other person" (lit. partner)
toshiue = "older (than the speaker)"
dakara = "so that's why; therefore"
umaku = (adverb derived from 'umai', modifying 'ikanakatta') = good; great
ikanakatta = "didn't work out; didn't go"
no = (a nominalizer, but here it is used as part of colloquial speech. it's optional)
kamo = (clipping of the phrase 'kamo shirenai') "maybe; probably"
(Grammar note: 'Umaku iku' is a often used phrase that means 'to work out well.' You often hear it when someone is talking about the relationship between two people. For example, if someone wanted to ask someone else about how the relationship between that person and his/her partner was going, you might hear this: 'Kareshi (kanojo) to umaku itteru?")
So, my translation would be:
"It probably didn't work out well because the other person was older (or 'too old for him/her')."
(lit. 'The other person was older, and perhaps therefore it didn't work out well.')
HTH,
������ _________________
"I like the word 'indolence'. It makes my laziness seem classy."
-Bern Williams
Joined: 11 Dec 2003 Posts: 406 Location: ������ Country:
Posted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:38 am Post subject:
kokuou wrote:
So, my translation would be:
"It probably didn't work out well because the other person was older (or 'too old for him/her')."
HTH,
������
* SuperMidget shakes hands with ����
edit:
by the way, it took me a few seconds to remember as well but scanlations are scanned translated manga. A bit of a stupid word if you ask me. Like calling fansubs "riplations" _________________
�@
�Y�����s������
Last edited by supermidget on Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:42 am; edited 1 time in total
I hope someone can help me here, I'm going to tokyo soon, and I'm interested in one of these restaurants. The first one is out of hte question because i won't be there Monday.
this is really difficult to understand even with the dictionary,can someone tell me what does the third restaurant (the one with 70 points)'s description say? Thanks!!!
Joined: 04 Jun 2004 Posts: 506 Location: Canada Country:
Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 6:42 pm Post subject: Re: Two different ways to use "but?" (demo, dakedo
DougFunnieee wrote:
when do you use which?
Please post any questions that have to do with Japanese language here.
As for your question, it all depends on context.
Both �ł� (demo) and ������ (dakedo) usually cannot be used as conjunctions.
(note: any sentence with a * at the beginning denotes ungrammaticality, and ?? indicates that the sentence, although could be considered gramatical depending on the situation, is odd.)
*�ꏏ�ɍs�������ł��A���Ԃ��Ȃ��B(Issho ni ikitai demo jikan ga nai.)
"I want to go with you, but I don't have time."
??�ꏏ�ɍs�����������ǁA���Ԃ��Ȃ��B(Issho ni ikitai dakedo jikan ga nai.)
"I want to go with you, but I don't have time."
You can, however, use ������ (dakedo) if you stick an �� (n) after the regular verb form.
�ꏏ�ɍs���������ǁA���Ԃ��Ȃ��B(Issho ni ikitai n dakedo jikan ga nai.)
"I want to go with you, but I don't have time."
It works with past and non-past tenses as well:
�ꏏ�ɍs�������������ǁA���Ԃ��Ȃ������B(Issho ni ikitakatta n dakedo jikan ga nakatta.)
"I wanted to go with you, but I didn't have time."
�ꏏ�ɍs�����ǁA�������Ȃ��B(Issho ni iku n dakedo okane ga nai.)
"I'm going (will go) with you, but I don't have money."
This does not work with �ł� (demo), however:
*�ꏏ�ɍs��������ł��A���Ԃ��Ȃ��B(Issho ni ikitai n demo, jikan ga nai.)
"I want to go with you, but I don't have time."
�ł� (demo) is usually found at the beginning of clauses:
�ꏏ�ɍs�������B�ł��A���Ԃ��Ȃ��B(Issho ni ikitai. Demo, jikan ga nai.)
"I want to go with you. However, I don't have time."
I'm sure there're areas that I haven't touched on here, but the hour is late and my bed beckons to me with it's sweet, sweet dream-filled voice.
�͂��A���܂����[�@�@(�K�́B)�ˬˬˬˬˬˬ
HTH,
������ _________________
"I like the word 'indolence'. It makes my laziness seem classy."
-Bern Williams
Joined: 28 Oct 2005 Posts: 311 Location: With my Tomo Country:
Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 6:56 pm Post subject:
I learn Japanese and now I learn particles (wa, ka, de, etc...) and I have one question Sweat
particles "wa" and "ga" have the same funcion and I can use "wa" or "ga" alwais? or there are exceptions and I only can use "wa" in one cases and "ga" in others cases?
and particles "de" and "ni" I have the same problem b/c 2 particles have the same funcion too...
Joined: 11 Dec 2003 Posts: 406 Location: ������ Country:
Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:35 pm Post subject:
Chisa wrote:
I learn Japanese and now I learn particles (wa, ka, de, etc...) and I have one question Sweat
particles "wa" and "ga" have the same funcion and I can use "wa" or "ga" alwais? or there are exceptions and I only can use "wa" in one cases and "ga" in others cases?
and particles "de" and "ni" I have the same problem b/c 2 particles have the same funcion too...
Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:17 pm Post subject: Re: hello,every body!
Chisa wrote:
wow, welcome to this forum 緞^(is read: Qiu Jie?)!!!!!!
You are Chinese? is so good
���̓X�y�C���l�ł��A��낵�����肢���܂��I�I�I�I
���]你���p这��!!!!
(sorry for my bad Chinese)
if you had said :"sorry for my bad Chinese",I had to say "sorry for my bad English too",English is the second language in many country.But i can't learn it well.I just join here for studying English although it is Janpanese forum.I read your talk,i think ,that is better than i read text book.I'm so worry that I can't pass the hierachical exam when they have passed.
�撣��!
I only can say it morning and morning.
Joined: 28 Oct 2005 Posts: 311 Location: With my Tomo Country:
Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 12:24 am Post subject: Re: hello,every body!
hptm wrote:
if you had said :"sorry for my bad Chinese",I had to say "sorry for my bad English too",English is the second language in many country.But i can't learn it well.I just join here for studying English although it is Janpanese forum.I read your talk,i think ,that is better than i read text book.I'm so worry that I can't pass the hierachical exam when they have passed.
�撣��!
I only can say it morning and morning.
别�S�S!! You're english isn't but and hountoni here you can learn mooore english ^o^ bc me too learn more here bc I'm spanish and english is my 3º language >.< and here I learn very much
I hope someone can help me here, I'm going to tokyo soon, and I'm interested in one of these restaurants. The first one is out of hte question because i won't be there Monday.
this is really difficult to understand even with the dictionary,can someone tell me what does the third restaurant (the one with 70 points)'s description say? Thanks!!!
I'm not going to translate directly, but basically what they say aout the food is:
- They got toro and jike as they took their seats (freebie appetizer, I assume)
- There are 70 items on the menu, but they may not always be available depending on the season
- Everything was delicious. Their favorite was the nama tako. They also had stuff like hamaguri and ikura, uni, and tsuma aji.
- Midori Sushi (the restaurant at the top) was delicious too, but their sushi was too large and filling. In comparison, this place gave smaller portions so that you could taste a lot of different items.
- At the end of the meal, they serve fruits, that day it was watermelon.
- Warning to customers: There's only one chef, so you need to plan your orders ahead of time....meaning things can be slooooow....
BTW, 70�� isn't "points"... A lot of bars/restarants in Japan have these timed specials where you get all you can drink or all you can eat (depending on the place) within a time limit...In this case, the place costs 4100 yen for men and 3670 yen for women to get all you can eat sushi in 70 minutes, drinks not included...
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Actually I concider myself still a beginner, since I'm only a second year student. I don't have so much experience in using Japanese in daily life so what I know is mainy "book-stuff". And never forget... since anyone can have questions, anyone can have answers right?
