“ú–{Œê‚Ì—ûK

hee hee hee san,dozou yoroshikune. :D

M wrote:‚Ù‚ñ‚Æ‚¤‚Å‚·‚©H@‚·‚²‚¨``‚¢III
wooooooooott!!!
J-STUFF go international!!!

^_^ @ŽÀ‚́BBƒpƒLƒXƒ^ƒ“‚Å“ú–{Œê‚ðK‚¤‚Ì‚Í‚È‚©‚È‚©’¿‚µ‚¢‚±‚Æ‚Å‚·‚æB’N‚©‚Ɂ@h“ú–{Œê‚ð•×‹­‚µ‚Ä‚éh‚Á‚ÄŒ¾‚Á‚½‚畁’Ê‚Ì”½‰ž‚́@h‚¦‚¦I‚È‚ºHIh@Žc”O‚¾‚È‚ 

:love_eyes: @KAORU!!! :love_eyes:

‚Ì‚ÇŽ©–‚Í‚Ë‚¦BBBƒeƒŒƒr”Ô‘g‚ðŒ©‚½‚±‚Æ‚Í‚È‚¢‚¯‚ǁBB‚Ì‚ÇŽ©–‚̉f‰æ‚Í‚È‚©‚È‚©–Ê”’‚©‚Á‚½‚ñ‚¾‚æIŽºˆäŽ ‚³‚ñ‚à‚¢‚½IiGIFT‚ÌŽºˆäŽ j@

echidna_leonhart wrote: :love_eyes: @KAORU!!! :love_eyes:

‚È‚ñ‚ŁH@V‘qŒO‚͍D‚«‚Å‚·‚©H

‚ ‚́BBB ŠF‚³‚ñBBB ŽÀ‚Í“ú–{Œê‚̕׋­‚Å‚¿‚傤‚Æ–â‘肪‚ ‚é‚ñ‚¯‚ǁAŒN’B‚É•·‚¢‚Ä‚à‚¢‚¢‚Å‚·‚©?

“z‚É‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾
“z‚ª‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾
“z‚͉´‚É‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾

“z‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾
“z‚ª‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾
“z‚͉´‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾

“z‚É‚³‚¹‚ç‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾

the sentences above... which are grammatically correct and which are not? and for those which are grammatically correct, what do they actually mean?

‚»‚ê‚ƁBBB

1B‰J‚ª~‚è‚»‚¤
2B‰J‚ª~‚é‚»‚¤

1 ‚Æ 2 Aˆá‚¤‚Æ‚±‚Í‚È‚ñ‚Å‚·‚©?

windrider wrote:‚»‚ê‚ƁBBB

1B‰J‚ª~‚è‚»‚¤
2B‰J‚ª~‚é‚»‚¤

1 ‚Æ 2 Aˆá‚¤‚Æ‚±‚Í‚È‚ñ‚Å‚·‚©?

‰J‚ª~‚è‚»‚¤ is used when the look of a thing/present leads you to presuppose an occurance.
‚½‚Æ‚¦‚΁Ayou see some dark clouds in the sky, then base on what you see, you make the comment ‰J‚ª~‚è‚»‚¤----meaning it looks like it is going to rain.

‰J‚ª~‚é‚»‚¤ is used when you merely conveying sth that you have obtained from other sources WITHOUT adding your own point of view. For example, ƒjƒ…[ƒX‚É‚æ‚é‚ƁA–¾“ú‚͉J‚ª~‚é‚»‚¤BAccording to the news, it will rain tomorrow.

•ª‚©‚è‚Ü‚·‚©H :mrgreen:

windrider wrote:‚ ‚́BBB ŠF‚³‚ñBBB ŽÀ‚Í“ú–{Œê‚̕׋­‚Å‚¿‚傤‚Æ–â‘肪‚ ‚é‚ñ‚¯‚ǁAŒN’B‚É•·‚¢‚Ä‚à‚¢‚¢‚Å‚·‚©?

“z‚É‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾
“z‚ª‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾
“z‚͉´‚É‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾

“z‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾
“z‚ª‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾
“z‚͉´‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾

“z‚É‚³‚¹‚ç‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾

the sentences above... which are grammatically correct and which are not? and for those which are grammatically correct, what do they actually mean?

‚¢‚¢‚íAŽ„‚Í“š‚¦‚Ä‚Ý‚Ü‚·B‚Å‚àA³‚µ‚¢‚©‚Ç‚¤‚©A•ª‚©‚è‚Ü‚¹‚ñ ....

“z is chap/guy according to my dictionary.

assuming the verb that u used here is ‚·‚é then

“z‚É‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾----------means ( I ) made him do it.
“z‚ª‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾----------means He was the one who made (someone) do it.
“z‚͉´‚É‚³‚¹‚½‚ñ‚¾-------means He made me do it.

above are the causative form

“z‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾---------means ( I ) was made to do it by him
“z‚ª‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾---------means It was done by him.
“z‚͉´‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾-------means He was made to do it by me.

above are the passive form

“z‚É‚³‚¹‚ç‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾------think this one is grammatically correct too but errr.....well.....i havent learn abt it but i think it is sth called passive-causative form...sorrie :sweat:

A Grammatical Japanese lesson ne Himitsu.. :mrgreen:

•‚©‚è‚Ü‚µ‚½BBB ‚Ù‚ñ‚Æ‚¤‚É‚ ‚肪‚Æ‚²‚´‚¢‚Ü‚µ‚½”é–§‚³‚ñ :D

windrider wrote:•‚©‚è‚Ü‚µ‚½BBB ‚Ù‚ñ‚Æ‚¤‚É‚ ‚肪‚Æ‚²‚´‚¢‚Ü‚µ‚½”é–§‚³‚ñ :D

:mrgreen: ‚Ç‚¤‚¢‚½‚µ‚Ü‚µ‚Ä

himitsu wrote:
“z‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾---------means ( I ) was made to do it by him
“z‚ª‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾---------means It was done by him.
“z‚͉´‚É‚³‚ꂽ‚ñ‚¾-------means He was made to do it by me.

above are the passive form

That is actually incorrect. I don't have time now, but later i'll post an explanation of passive forms, and passive-causative. They are pretty confusing, aren't they?

yeah... really pretty confusing... jaa jikan ga dekitara zehi oshiete ittadakitaindesu... arigato ne :mrgreen:

echidna_leonhart wrote:

That is actually incorrect. I don't have time now, but later i'll post an explanation of passive forms, and passive-causative. They are pretty confusing, aren't they?

thanks for pointing out my mistake..i realized that my translation of the statement is wrong. echidna_leonhart san, am i right to say that i have translated the passive form statements into passive-causative form??
cause from what i see the statements are in passive form.....chigaimasu ka? but i cant possibly translate it into "i was done by him" right?

:rolleyes2: :rolleyes2:

thats why i asked if the sentences i asked were grammatically correct... i was just anyhow shooting... :mrgreen: those sentences i wrote were not taken from textbooks or anything... i was just wondering whether some of sentences were actually correct

windrider wrote:thats why i asked if the sentences i asked were grammatically correct... i was just anyhow shooting... :mrgreen: those sentences i wrote were not taken from textbooks or anything... i was just wondering whether some of sentences were actually correct

sorry for telling you the wrong things :shakehead: :(

iee, zenzen! Whether it was right or wrong, at least u attempted to help, thanks alot, really.

Sorry for such a late reply, i've had a lot of Uni. entrance stuff going on. Anyways, i hope this helps. :D


Causative form (to allow or make someone do something):

{Noun} wa {Noun} ni {verb} saseru
A-san wa B-san ni {verb}saseru :: A-san allowed/made B-san do {verb}
The action is carried out by B-san. (A-san has authority over B-san)

X-san wa/ga saseru :: X-san does the forcing or allowing of the verb
X-san ni/o saseru :: X-san carries out the action in the verb

e.g. Okaasan wa Takuya ni kusuri o nomaseru
Okaasan wa nomaseru
Takuya ni nomaseru



Passive form (to have something done to you):

{Noun} wa {Noun} ni {verb} sareru
A-san wa B-san ni {verb} sareru :: B does something that affects A

The action is carried out by B-san. A-san is at the recieving end, and usually but not always suffers from the action. The verb is being done to A-san by B-san.

X-san wa/ga sareru :: X-san is at the recieving end of the verb
X-san ni sareru :: X-san carries out the action in the verb

e.g. Takuya wa tomodachi ni sake o nomareru
Takuya wa nomareru
Tomodachi ni nomareru



Causative Passive form (subject is made to do something against their will):

This is kinda like a mixture of both forms. Think of it like this, it takes the meaning of causative and puts it in the format of passive.

{Noun} wa {Noun} ni {verb} saserareru
A-san wa B-san ni {verb} saserareru :: A is forced into doing {verb} by B

The action is carried out by A-san. B-san has made A-san do the verb. A-san suffers from this.

X-san wa/ga saserareru :: X-san does the verb against their will
X-san ni saserareru :: X-san has forced the other person to do something

e.g Takuya wa Okaasan ni kusuri o nomaserareru
Takuya wa nomaserareru
Okaasan ni nomaserareru


There ya go! I haven't translated the e.g's coz it's better if you try to do that yourself. Make up your own sentences and practice. Good luck with it! If you have any questions just ask.

wahhhh that last part on the causative passive form really helped, Thanks a million! i have one more question.

A-san ga sasetanda

B-san ga saretanda

C-san ga saseraretanda

The 3 sentences above, are they considered legimate sentences? If so can give some examples on how to use them please?

‚±‚ñ‚É‚¿‚Í
Bedi‚Ɛ\‚µ‚Ü‚·B‚æ‚낵‚­‚¨‚Ë‚ª‚¢‚µ‚Ü‚·B
ŠF‚³‚ñ“ú–{Œê‚ªãŽè‚Å‚·‚ˁB‚¢‚‚©‚ç“ú–{Œê‚ð•×‹­‚µ‚Ä‚¢‚Ü‚·‚©H

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Please correct me if I made a mistake. I wasn't 100% sure about the 'nihongo de jouzu....' part. Also not very sure about the 'comma' :sweat:
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