Morning musume...

Hanzo21 wrote:

If you honestly think that, you've been hanging around the wrong crowd.

come on man..that is ridiculously weak...that's your rebuttal?!? pure rhetoric.

very lacking.

Tu_triky wrote:
when he refused with incredulity they asked him if him if prefered a "a junior high school" girl.

man...that is SOO wrong :shakehead: :shakehead:

Tu_triky wrote:

come on man..that is ridiculousy weak...that's your rebuttal?!?

very lacking.

I wanted to say it shows your ignorance. But didn't. I've only run into one incident like that in 20 years of being with Japanese people and in Japan. That's not to say a seedy underworld doesn't exist. But that small subset exists everywhere. I suspect Japan's scandals get played out more heavily than their normally mundane lives.

K.T.Tran wrote:


man...that is SOO wrong :shakehead: :shakehead:

Agreed.

What I want to know is, whose daughters are they pimping out? Who would agree to something like that?

Hanzo21 wrote:

I've heard them too. But what I can say is that in over 20 years of only being with Japanese girls, only one time heard personally a "horror" story. A friend was showing me around Osaka. Mentioned to her that the subway system is cool. She said that one time a guy was feeling her up on a packed train. She got off in tears. But couldn't do anything. That's terrible.

if you INSIST on focusing on japanese trains as your exceptional example of japanese behavior HOW come they instituted a FEMALE only car on certain japanese subways...that proves such lecherous behvaior isn't so rare you seem to imply

Japan Tries Women-Only Train Cars to Stop Groping
Tokyo Subway Experiment Attempts to Slow Epidemic of Subway Fondling
June 10, 2005 — - Japan's capital is facing an epidemic of men who can't keep their hands to themselves, and it's happening inside one of its most famous symbols -- the trains.

Whether above the crowded streets or below ground, Tokyo's trains are renowned for their efficiency and cleanliness.

But according to a survey conducted in Tokyo last year, nearly 64 percent of Japanese women in their 20s and 30s said they've been groped on trains, subways or at transit stations in the city.

=============================


Women Often Ashamed to Speak Out

These subway gropers -- who lean, rub and pinch during the remarkably crowded rush hours -- are known in Japanese as "chikan."

Victims are often ashamed to show their faces. They say the experience is degrading, humiliating and frightening, but most are too embarrassed to react when it's happening.


"They think it's a kind of shame to say something or to cry, 'Help, help,'" said Mihoko Ejiri, a professor at Tsuda College of Women.

Women-Only Train Cars

But now, there is some temporary relief for Japanese women -- a train car of their own. It's just an experiment now, and only during rush hour, but for those who have been harassed, it has made a huge difference.

One woman passenger told ABC News, "Because it's just only girls, females, and we don't touch, you know, so c [it's] very safe!"

Even most men seem to think the women-only cars are fair. Many men worry about being falsely accused of groping if they accidentally brush up against a woman in a packed train. Gropers can be imprisoned for up to seven years or fined up to $485.

But there's also some grumbling, especially in overcrowded adjacent cars, where the men are packed like sardines, while the ladies ride in comfort.


However, as one newpaper editorial in Tokyo suggested, the victims did not bring about the women-only experiment, but the "chikan."

















Copyright © 2006 ABC News Internet Ventures

Hey Tu_triky

Sorry about that last post. It seems we've experienced Japan in different ways. I'm not a tourist when there. And my experiences might be somewhat sheltered by relatives and friends. But generally we do everything with friends.

You know, the strangest and most disturbing thing I ever saw in Japan was in Sannomiya at an outdoor cafe. Across the walkway there was young girl (maybe 15 or 16) in a very short yellow miniskirt. She leaned against a wall showing that she had no underwear on. She made sure to look around to make sure everybody saw it. She did that a couple times, bend over to lean against something while making a cell-phone call.

Tu_triky wrote:

if you INSIST on focusing on japanese trains as your exceptional example of japanese behavior HOW come they instituted a FEMALE only car on certain japanese subways...that proves such lecherous behvaior isn't so rare you seem to imply

Japan Tries Women-Only Train Cars to Stop Groping
Tokyo Subway Experiment Attempts to Slow Epidemic of Subway Fondling
June 10, 2005 \ - Japan's capital is facing an epidemic of men who can't keep their hands to themselves, and it's happening inside one of its most famous symbols -- the trains.

Whether above the crowded streets or below ground, Tokyo's trains are renowned for their efficiency and cleanliness.

But according to a survey conducted in Tokyo last year, nearly 64 percent of Japanese women in their 20s and 30s said they've been groped on trains, subways or at transit stations in the city.

=============================


Women Often Ashamed to Speak Out

These subway gropers -- who lean, rub and pinch during the remarkably crowded rush hours -- are known in Japanese as "chikan."

Victims are often ashamed to show their faces. They say the experience is degrading, humiliating and frightening, but most are too embarrassed to react when it's happening.


"They think it's a kind of shame to say something or to cry, 'Help, help,'" said Mihoko Ejiri, a professor at Tsuda College of Women.

Women-Only Train Cars

But now, there is some temporary relief for Japanese women -- a train car of their own. It's just an experiment now, and only during rush hour, but for those who have been harassed, it has made a huge difference.

One woman passenger told ABC News, "Because it's just only girls, females, and we don't touch, you know, so c [it's] very safe!"

Even most men seem to think the women-only cars are fair. Many men worry about being falsely accused of groping if they accidentally brush up against a woman in a packed train. Gropers can be imprisoned for up to seven years or fined up to $485.

But there's also some grumbling, especially in overcrowded adjacent cars, where the men are packed like sardines, while the ladies ride in comfort.


However, as one newpaper editorial in Tokyo suggested, the victims did not bring about the women-only experiment, but the "chikan."

















Copyright © 2006 ABC News Internet Ventures

Surely some of that exists. But I haven't seen it or heard much about it except from one friend. It's just more sensationalism. I can ask my wife right here who worked in downtown Osaka (commuting by train and subway from Kobe everyday) how prevalent that sort of thing is. It's almost non existent. And that was nearly 20 years ago when things were worse than today.

Hanzo21 wrote:Hey Tu_triky

Sorry about that last post. It seems we've experienced Japan in different ways. I'm not a tourist when there. And my experiences might be somewhat sheltered by relatives and friends. But generally we do everything with friends.

You know, the strangest and most disturbing thing I ever saw in Japan was in Sannomiya at an outdoor cafe. Across the walkway there was young girl (maybe 15 or 16) in a very short yellow miniskirt. She leaned against a wall showing that she had no underwear on. She made sure to look around to make sure everybody saw it. She did that a couple times, bend over to lean against something while making a cell-phone call.

Let me clarify...i don't hold you personally in any disdain...i am just vigorously arguing a perspective that is valid and omnipresent in japanese society as represented by complaints from an amalgam of japanese women....as the japanese female only train car represents....

i'm not trying to hate on you or any one else for that matter...i'm merely trying to explicate a reality in japanese society.....a reality that places women in a position that is not on par with japanese males...a position that identifies them as sexual objects not equal citizens in japense society.

I guess we kind of screwed up the Morning Musume thread unitl a few pages go by. Sorry Qilver.

But at any rate, there is nothing wrong with the rabid Japanese fans enjoying the Morning Musume shows. And there's nothing wrong with the rabid foreign fans enjoying the Morning Musume act.

Morning Musume... Ikou!

Tu_triky wrote:


Let me clarify...i don't hold you personally in any disdain...i am just vigorously arguing a perspective that is valid and omnipresent in japanese society as represented by complaints from an amalgam of japanese women....as the japanese female only train car represents....

i'm not trying to hate on you or any one else for that matter...i'm merely trying to explicate a reality in japanese society.....a reality that places women in a position that is not on par with japanese males...a position that identifies them as sexual objects not equal citizens in japense society.

ahh....anytime Tu-man visits the thread, expect some opinions....you either hate it, or accept it....if seems offensive, he is merely stating his opiniated mind, no harm done.

@Tu, i know you mean well, and are just stating your expressive thoughts onto this lovely thread.
Your point is taken, as i speak my mind, BUT, i feel it does not have a place on this thread, please take it elsewhere, Thanks.

Hanzo21 wrote:I guess we kind of screwed up the Morning Musume thread unitl a few pages go by. Sorry Qilver.

But at any rate, there is nothing wrong with the rabid Japanese fans enjoying the Morning Musume shows. And there's nothing wrong with the rabid foreign fans enjoying the Morning Musume act.

Morning Musume... Ikou!

take it at face value, and move on....He has his right to opinions and we have ours, whether it belongs here, that is our opinions, just have to be polite about it, and respect his opinionated views...

let's move on, shall we...i got pix to post, thanks.

qilver wrote:

ahh....anytime Tu-man visits the thread, expect some opinions....you either hate it, or accept it....if seems offensive, he is merely stating his opiniated mind, no harm done.

@Tu, i know you mean well, and are just stating your expressive thoughts onto this lovely thread.
Your point is taken, as i speak my mind, BUT, i feel it does not have a place on this thread, please take it elsewhere, Thanks.

you may feel that way, no disrespect...but if i'm going to bring an academic perspective to a subject, i will bring it regardless if ppl are accepting of such opinions or not.....if i'm gong to rationally discuss something as i have above....just because ppl don't agree isn't going to dissuade me from voicing my opinion....i've studied such issues academically and casually...just because some ppl are loathe to address such issues isn't going to cause me to cower into a corner.

i'm too well educated and opinionated for that...

Tu_triky wrote:

you may feel that way, no disrespect...but if i'm going to bring an academic perspective to a subject, i will bring it regardless if ppl are accepting of such opinions or not.....if i'm gong to rationally discuss something as i have above....just because ppl don't agree isn't going to dissuade me from voicing my opinion....i've studied such issues academically and casually...just because some ppl are loathe to address such issues isn't going to cause me to cower into a corner.

i'm too well educated and opinionated for that...

I don't disagree with your background, and intellect, but what i do question is the tone, and what it brings to the thread, perhaps you should take your expressions to the "Got something to say" thread, you have valid points and can back it up, but no need to ruffle any feathers (an interest PUN, i have chosen lol).

i've been on this thread, pretty much as long as you, and i say respectfully, let the MM obsessed fans, enjoy their thread. Thanks. :applaud:

qilver wrote:

take it at face value, and move on....He has his right to opinions and we have ours, whether it belongs here, that is our opinions, just have to be polite about it, and respect his opinionated views...

let's move on, shall we...i got pix to post, thanks.

Let's see some pictures! :bonk:

BTW, I posted a couple good ones this afternoon. :bonk:

Hanzo21 wrote:

Let's see some pictures! :bonk:

BTW, I posted a couple good ones this afternoon. :bonk:

on with the show then... :banghead: :rofl:

i d/l'ed Ai-chan's lastest "making of the dvd", got some excellent scrn caps....think it would be ok to post?
i've got some catching up to do.....will chk out your MM pix. :applaud: :bow:

qilver wrote:

I don't disagree with your background, and intellect, but what i do question is the tone, and what it brings to the thread, perhaps you should take your expressions to the "Got something to say" thread, you have valid points and can back it up, but no need to ruffle any feathers (an interest PUN, i have chosen lol).

i've been on this thread, pretty much as long as you, and i say respectfully, let the MM obsessed fans, enjoy their thread. Thanks. :applaud:

i am not, in any way, saying you shouldn't enjoy MM but i'm bringing a rationale perspective to the issue of young japanese as regarded by japanese males et al.

if my tone disturbs you, well i can't reconcile that with the points i'm trying to make....nobody can comfort everybody all the time when trying to elucidate a point.. if you think i'm trying to thrust ad hominem attacks against individuals here...i must say that's a narrow vision...that's not my goal.

some ppl have difficulty facing the music as it were....

qilver wrote:

on with the show then... :banghead: :rofl:

i d/l'ed Ai-chan's lastest "making of the dvd", got some excellent scrn caps....think it would be ok to post?
i've got some catching up to do.....will chk out your MM pix. :applaud: :bow:

OK to post? That's what this thread is all about! The worship and adulation of Japan's top singing group!

Tu_triky wrote:

i am not, in any way, saying you shouldn't enjoy MM but i'm bringing a rationale perspective to the issue of young japanese as regarded by japanese males et al.

if my tone disturbs you, well i can't reconcile that with the points i'm trying to make....nobody can comfort everybody all the time when trying to elucidate a point.. if you think i'm trying to thrust ad hominem attacks against individuals here...i must say that's a narrow vision...that's not my goal.

some ppl have difficulty facing the music as it were....

personally, i am not affected on what you bring, i know how you are, and really, we've been down a similar road, it's cool dude.

But after a point, there is so further discussion to bring forth. I am not asking you to reconcile furthermore, just that you take this "valid discussion" to another thread, where I feel it is more fitting.

But remember, if anyone else feels offended by your opinionated remarks, that is something that is handled directly between you and the other party. I am a 3rd party coming in, and just stating my thoughts on this matter.
and Tu, not every here's your type of music... :mrgreen:

so, Again, your points are very valid, and i don't wish to dive into an intellectual discussion on this further, since this is the Morning Musume thread, and i feel it about the topic.

Hanzo21 wrote:

OK to post? That's what this thread is all about! The worship and adulation of Japan's top singing group!

well....it's because it was from a new pb...wasn't exactly sure on it...just wanted another person's opinion. :bonk:

Hanzo21 wrote:
Japan's top singing group!

Are they really Japan's top singing group overall? or just Top female singing group....


I mean I know they're popular and all but #1 in Japan??? :sweat: :sweat: