Wynter wrote:I dunno. There's a difference between being a pessimist and a realist. A pessimist sees the negative side of things, with little hope of seeing a difference.
A realist looks at things at face value.
As we've seen in the past, history will always repeat itself. War will continue to exist. To some degree. It only takes one person to spread the poison. Until we realize that war doesn't solve anything, there will be war.
That's looking at it at face value.
Personally I do hope that one day there will be global peace. And I think that as years go by, we get closer to achieving this goal. It's just a matter of time and patience, and hopefully not too much destruction in the process.
Wynter wrote:War will never cease to exist. They're an exaggerated version of arguments and are almost always created through a difference of opinion between two or more parties. It's both sad and humbling to know that we'll never - so long as we're different - learn from our mistakes and/or from history.
Always an elegant answer from the lovely sensei, though you're in error about the causes. War isn't about difference of opinions, it's about interests. Interests can be self preservation, economic or domestic stability, ranging all the way to the desire of isolationalism. That's why the whole "when hearts change" won't make a difference. The assumption that most modernized countries aren't going to war with each other because "hearts have changed" is wrong. We don't because it's in our interests not to......until the time comes when it does. Since this is Jdorama.com, I'll use Japan as an example. Anyone who doesn't believe we will go to war with Japan again in the next 50-100 years has their fingers in their ears. Japan, as modern and pacifist as it has become, has the solid foundation for a modern country to go to war with another, and within the aforementioned timeframe that foundation will come to the foreground. Pacifism only exists in an environment where it doesn't have to be tested.
Until we realize that war doesn't solve anything....
The contrary actually. History has shown that war is the great resolver of issues and problems. Ultimately it's how things get done in the real world. That's why there'll never be global peace. The illusion of "getting closer to global peace" is a result of the "endless" fighting. Take it away, and we'd see more wars, not less.
ETA: Damn. Missed that you wanted to change the subject. Sorry. :sweat:
But lets change the subject. Talking about war gets me down and it's too beautiful a day!
Just because you don't want to participate in this discussion it doesn't mean it should end, does it? :confused:
Kijinnmaru wrote:Always an elegant answer from the lovely sensei, though you're in error about the causes. War isn't about difference of opinions, it's about interests. Interests can be self preservation, economic or domestic stability, ranging all the way to the desire of isolationalism. That's why the whole "when hearts change" won't make a difference. The assumption that most modernized countries aren't going to war with each other because "hearts have changed" is wrong. We don't because it's in our interests not to......until the time comes when it does. Since this is Jdorama.com, I'll use Japan as an example. Anyone who doesn't believe we will go to war with Japan again in the next 50-100 years has their fingers in their ears. Japan, as modern and pacifist as it has become, has the solid foundation for a modern country to go to war with another, and within the aforementioned timeframe that foundation will come to the foreground. Pacifism only exists in an environment where it doesn't have to be tested.
Sorry Kijinnmaru I am going to have to respectfully disagree with you. I agree on the 'interests' part and war, but interests aren't born out of thin air. Things that people want the most like their freedom or the ability to vote or have a decent place to live or raise a family, be able to eat on a daily basis ...are mostly common human interests. These types of issues stem from the basic heart and mind of most decent human beings. Now I am aware that my thoughts are really basic and simplistic but I like them that way. :D Interests change when the human heart changes at its'most basic level. Anger, greed and stupidity exist because some humans haven't tapped into their higher natures yet. :victory: Pacifism is in each one of us, we weren't all born violent and warlike, we have to allow it to come forth on a daily basis in everything we think, say and do. I am just realistic enough to believe that peace is possible. :victory:
bmwracer wrote:Pessimist here :sweat:
Aaah b-kun try looking at the glass half full sometime. :D :victory:
I may be wrong about this but aren't there more peaceful places on the planet now then there are places of war? :)
this is worth a glimpse. I wonder if this young samurai would be on the lists of hearthrobs in Japanese entertainment nowadays. He seemed to have captured NYC in 1860. It's quite fascinating to read about this visit.
Very interesting to me to think of the ways that history plays itself out. What was going on in Japan then was an upheaval of the shogunate and the whole samurai world. Bushido is still in the background basis in Japan with husiness and education.
Kijinnmaru wrote:ETA: Damn. Missed that you wanted to change the subject. Sorry. :sweat:
Nono, at the time no one was on, so I thought I'd branch out. No worries, a conversation with so much interest should continue!
gaijinmark wrote:
Why? Did it end up tasting like refried beans covered with dill pickles??
Ewww! And no, thank goodness. lol
Enna wrote:Just because you don't want to participate in this discussion it doesn't mean it should end, does it?
No of course not! And I never said I didn't want to participate... :headscratch: I was posting directly to the convo with BMW (hence the quote), not ending the conversation for everyone. Please continue on.
this is worth a glimpse. I wonder if this young samurai would be on the lists of hearthrobs in Japanese entertainment nowadays. He seemed to have captured NYC in 1860. It's quite fascinating to read about this visit.
Wow, I'm very interested to hear this "Tommy Polka" now!
Wynter wrote: But lets change the subject. Talking about war gets me down and it's too beautiful a day!
Wynter wrote:
No of course not! And I never said I didn't want to participate...:headscratch:
@Wynter: Since you said lets change the subject and it made you depressed I assumed you didn't want to participate in it anymore. Or you didn't want others discussing it anymore. Isn't that what 'lets change the subject" means? :)
@Wynter: Since you said lets change the subject and it made you depressed I assumed you didn't want to participate in it anymore. Or you didn't want others discussing it anymore. Isn't that what 'lets change the subject" means? :)
Yes, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding. I was talking to BMW at the time when I said "lets change the subject" since he was the only one on and it was his post that I had quoted. I didn't mean to end the whole conversation. Please carry on.
Kijinnmaru wrote:
The contrary actually. History has shown that war is the great resolver of issues and problems. Ultimately it's how things get done in the real world. That's why there'll never be global peace. The illusion of "getting closer to global peace" is a result of the "endless" fighting. Take it away, and we'd see more wars, not less.
We are a primitive race and not evolved enough to manage without war.
I agree with your comment about it being caused by "interests". To me, greed has always been the main motivator, regardless of what cause was named.
On Topic: HAppy Fourth, Minna-san!!
Hope you get to see fireworks!!!
Don't know if we will see fireworks tonight. Still having
'June Gloom' here on the California coast. It is getting murky now at
eight o'clock and they don't start the works until nine usually. I can watch from the patio and they light up over the harbour. Nice on a clear night.
There was an amazing ballet which was called 'The Green Table' It was made by Kurt Jooss in 1932. Subsequently he had to flee Nazi Germany because he would not get rid of some Jewish members in his company. The ballet was a very antiwar theme. I saw this on film many years ago and it always stayed in my memory.
I am sure it must be floating around on the Internet somewhere. It shows the old men around the table with the green top and they are arguing and as usual it ends up in war. Then Death takes over..and not just for the young men dancing a theme. Avant garde with piano music but I don't know if it has been done that way since. Maybe it's time to do it again.
War can be very obliterating.